Pirates

[Josiah]

With all due respect to DSOP and the great John McLaughlin, comparing losing someone'e livelihood to being killed is ridiculous. Also, it's my opinion that record stores and the music industry is dead because of their inability to embrace changes in technology and the methods of distributing their product.

Well Said. sums it all up perfectly.

it seems that John likens himself to a modern rock or pop act. he is not. he is a very, VERY, NICHE musician.


case example

TOOL sold out 2 (!) nights at RedRocks a few months ago, in 15 minutes. flat out.

John couldn't sell out RedRocks if he tried. which he doesn't, so there you go.

and it should also be noted TOOL has only come out with 5 studio albums in like what? 15 years?


its an old man bitching about what is. the fact the matter is, if i download one of his discs its to check it out at most, certainly nothing i would pay for and even more so, nothing i would go pay for to see live.

i figure myself the 'above average consumer', i spend well over a 2 grand a year in tickets for live shows. and ive yet to be disappointed.


it should also be noted, that while i may be in the minority for this one, its not unheard of. I will mail a band money, say $5 for an album i downloaded. because 1. I know the percentage album sales are, it's a joke. 2. its more personal.

and 3. if its that good, i'll go to a concert, fork out $50-200 for a ticket and see a badass live show. maybe even buy a tshirt for an absurdly inflated 30-50 bucks... all in all, they make more off me as a fan, being CONVINCED by the MUSIC, then they loose from an album sale not purchased.

and I can faithfully say that is true for many of my friends. fuck buying the album, but if you put out something awesome, we'll come see you.

[littlegrooves]

TOOL sold out 2 (!) nights at RedRocks a few months ago, in 15 minutes. flat out.

John couldn't sell out RedRocks if he tried. which he doesn't, so there you go.

It's cause John isn't wearing a cowboy hat and a speedo on stage like Maynard.

John needs to wear a cowboy hat and a speedo on stage like Maynard.

Problem = Solved

[janne jansson]

I think you are coming out a bit arrogant..

it seems that John likens himself to a modern rock or pop act. he is not. he is a very, VERY, NICHE musician.

He used to make a living from his recordsales, now he does not....

its an old man bitching about what is. the fact the matter is, if i download one of his discs its to check it out at most, certainly nothing i would pay for and even more so, nothing i would go pay for to see live.

He would like people to pay and not steal his music...and i guess you don`agree

This is the man who almost invented Jazzrock and fusion music.
I don`t understand that u all here can`t see it from his point of view...You only see it from your own.

[Snowdogyyz]

With all due respect to DSOP and the great John McLaughlin, comparing losing someone'e livelihood to being killed is ridiculous. Also, it's my opinion that record stores and the music industry is dead because of their inability to embrace changes in technology and the methods of distributing their product.

Well Said. sums it all up perfectly.

it seems that John likens himself to a modern rock or pop act. he is not. he is a very, VERY, NICHE musician.


case example

TOOL sold out 2 (!) nights at RedRocks a few months ago, in 15 minutes. flat out.

John couldn't sell out RedRocks if he tried. which he doesn't, so there you go.

and it should also be noted TOOL has only come out with 5 studio albums in like what? 15 years?


its an old man bitching about what is. the fact the matter is, if i download one of his discs its to check it out at most, certainly nothing i would pay for and even more so, nothing i would go pay for to see live.

i figure myself the 'above average consumer', i spend well over a 2 grand a year in tickets for live shows. and ive yet to be disappointed.


it should also be noted, that while i may be in the minority for this one, its not unheard of. I will mail a band money, say $5 for an album i downloaded. because 1. I know the percentage album sales are, it's a joke. 2. its more personal.

and 3. if its that good, i'll go to a concert, fork out $50-200 for a ticket and see a badass live show. maybe even buy a tshirt for an absurdly inflated 30-50 bucks... all in all, they make more off me as a fan, being CONVINCED by the MUSIC, then they loose from an album sale not purchased.

and I can faithfully say that is true for many of my friends. fuck buying the album, but if you put out something awesome, we'll come see you.

Having a hard time deciphering some of your points here. Here is a point: you don't have to buy the album. Just don't illegally download it either. You are hurting the artist and the record label. This has nothing to do with the live show and who fills stadiums and who doesn't. I bet Maynard would want to kick you in the nuts if he found out you were illegally downloading his songs as well (not saying you are, just using it to make a point). I do think McLaughlin went overboard on his murder comparison, but his point is valid. It's not like he is an engineer during the day so he can make music. He is a musician and people are stealing his product. I'd be pissed too if it were me in that position.

[DSOP]

He would like people to pay and not steal his music...and i guess you don`agree.

I agree with you completely! PLEASE fix your quote and don't attribute that nonsense to me!

[janne jansson]

Sorry DSOP..I fixed it

[Yussuf]

It sure is a drag that artists lose money from pirating but the old days are gone and won't come back. Won't come back. Don't whine, just move on.
The great thing about internet is that now you can get your music heard all over the world. Even the most out-there bizarre stuff. Can't get any better than that IMO. If your music is truly great and you happen to play incredible live shows, people will gravitate towards your band. Try to get the money from them, sell t-shirts, limited edition records, whatever. Even if you don't make any big money in the process, enjoy the ride. Don't ever forget that feeling that made you play in the first place.

[Julián Fernández]

I don´t download stuff, and I´m aware that that kind of behavior can be frustrating to some, BUT I´m quite amazed how some people seem to be very accusatory about "net pirates" and never raise their voice to accuse some heavy shit the world is going through these days... Again, I´m not saying we should look the other way and just roll with it, but if I could be read of heard by thousands of people (like John for example) I would choose wisely what I wanna rant about...

[DSOP]

some heavy shit the world is going through these days...

You said it! It seems like society is on the verge of a major revolution and there will soon be blood in the streets.

[Josiah]

Having a hard time deciphering some of your points here. Here is a point: you don't have to buy the album. Just don't illegally download it either. You are hurting the artist and the record label. This has nothing to do with the live show and who fills stadiums and who doesn't. I bet Maynard would want to kick you in the nuts if he found out you were illegally downloading his songs as well (not saying you are, just using it to make a point). I do think McLaughlin went overboard on his murder comparison, but his point is valid. It's not like he is an engineer during the day so he can make music. He is a musician and people are stealing his product. I'd be pissed too if it were me in that position.

let me put it in another way.

there was a time when, i heard a song on the radio and went rode my bike down to the shop to buy the album. only to find that 2 or 3 or 4 songs were actually decent, and the rest sucked, fluff, etc. and that was when $17 was actually worth a decent chunk.

times have changed, and i ain't dropping money on albums blind. got burned plenty enough. if it's some great music, i'll buy it. even the vinyl, which i love. and then the concert tickets, etc.

but the fact is, i just cant bet money on EVERY musicians album. that's a truly absurd idea. now a days i can preview music and frankly, if its not worth buying, its worth deleting. and if John falls into that category, so be it.

it makes the music HONEST. instead of being a blind gamble.

not to say John isn't "good" at what he does, but if i listen to something once or twice and its not sticking, then its not truly worth the retail price. and that's my taste as a listener and his draw as an artist, figure the ratio how you like.

however my good guess would be that Johns crowd of fans is diminishing (and his record sales would be sans the internet anyway) just because of music evolution.

but non the less with 100's of new albums coming out every month, across the world, its impossible to ask someone to gamble money on them all for a maybe. if i download an album, listen to it, and it doesn't meet my tastes, its gone and never heard again, so be it, no harm no foul. there's only so much money to spread around. if your music moves me, i'm sold and will buy (I could be a minority on that).

so my statement to all of the guys is this "Make me a fan."

my support (aka money) is earned.