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Steven Orkin wrote:- What kind of sound should Dave go for? A hint: he's been messing with a totally open bass drum and some funny mic'ing to get a crazy FAT sound. A good idea?

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Steven Orkin wrote:
Please re-read what you wrote and ask yourself: is it productive to become fixated on the timeframe by which Dave Weckl communicates on Facebook? Or, to others in this forum, is it productive to become fixated on Pledge Music's decision to extend Dave's deadline?

I can't believe there is time for this kind of drama amidst all the pre-existing drama we all have to deal with.

You're setting a tone of desperation here. Is it necessary to misconstrue and ridicule? With asking the public for pledges comes more accountability...in more ways than one (and rightly so frankly). I want to hear some good music, but I don't want to be bombarded by less than upfront marketing schemes.

I don't mean to judge and I fully understand the need to try new things to get a CD or DVD out. This whole thing is a learning process as well. To me Dave is an artist, because he creates 'art'. He has a brilliant musical mind and he is a true master of the instrument. So, I listen to him. To what he has to say and to the stuff he comes up with. He is way beyond me and way beyond most musicians. What is happening now is like going to the greatest restaurant in the world and telling the chef what to cook...why? That chef can come up with stuff you would not be able to imagine yourself. That is why you go to such a restaurant. If he is playing 'what the fans want' it becomes entertainment...not art. He is able, and he should be leading the way. Pushing the envelope. Not asking for directions, if you catch my drift. I've had the pleasure of meeting Dave. It was genuine friendliness and I would feel really weird if I was paying to have dinner with him. The man is so awesome. If you have that kind of money, just invest in the project I'd say. That is another thing with this pledge stuff, that endless list of things you can buy. Like 'spent $12.000,- and join Dave as he is walking his dog'. It's silly to me. But there is this line I remember from my last visit to LA. Sheila E. put it this way, 'we Americans live by the rule "make money at all costs." To each his own

^ My sentiments exactly. Usually an artist creates a work of art (a recording in this instance) because they have something to share, a concept, a new idea, a new sound, something. To be raising money and then ask what the fans want to hear ends up coming across as a money making venture to fill in the calendar. I'm not saying these guys don't deserve to make money, but this "benefactor" approach with the direction influenced externally is rubbing me the wrong way.

This is one way to take a whack at the new business patterns that are being created by the demise of the recording industry.

There will be teething pains and some will get pissed, but that's life, isn't it?

Steven Orkin wrote:- What kind of sound should Dave go for? A hint: he's been messing with a totally open bass drum and some funny mic'ing to get a crazy FAT sound. A good idea?

I want to hear a drum recording that is not squashed or compressed to hell. I recently listened to Synergy on some KEF Q60 and Monitor Audio Gold bookshelf speakers with a Yamaha Studio subwoofer, and a Marantz 2015 receiver. I found that album to real pretty biting in the hi mids and up. The snare was very out front and very compressed sounding. It does not need to be EQ'd on the hi end in order to be heard I want an acoustic/folk sound. Something that can be played on a hifi sustem and enjoyed for the sonic bliss. A natural drum sound, with natural dynamics. I want mistakes included. No punch ins for solos, keep it real. I noticed on one of his play along video songs, that the solo part was punched in. The whole point about play alongs is to play along with it, not punch in. Dave is a good enough drummer to not punch in. If he has a lame fill, so what. I will enjoy a lame fill more than a punched in hyper fill.

In essence, go for HIFI. Go against the volume wars and give us something that would make a mega thousand dollar stereo system proud(or a budget-fi system like mine)

Okay, I gotta stick a sock in this "it's all for the art" bullsh*t. It isn't about the art here, it is about marketing and making money-- you know, that thing that we all do for at least 8 hours per day? Yeah, Weckl's got to do it too-- he ain't Dave Grohl sitting pretty on multi-millions. Dave Weckl, like a lot of the other drummers that get discussed on here, are a brand. Sometimes you need to market your brand... so what?

If you want to go the "it's all about the art" route, then fine-- we can do the history lesson thing: pick the top 25 greatest works of visual art in history and then put a check box next to the ones that were commissioned. Exactly.

The only way you make full-time money as an artist is if you: a.) perform you "original" art and strike a resonant cord with a wide enough group of people to be subsidized as fringe benefit; or, b.) compromise your art a little so that you can make a living doing what you love, even if the end result is not 100% what you would have created independent of the money factor.

Sometimes you might have to do a little "b" to get to do a little "a". Almost everyone in here has to do a little "c" to do a little "a", option "c" being working a 9-5. Whadya think, that these guys don't gotta pay for new undies, too?

Amazing the amount of negativety in this thread

IMO what started out as a good concept "hey help fund this project and we will take it what direction you want" has been completely lost...I always thought the drum community was supposed to have a special connection - DW wants to play fusion and thats his passion, respect it and why not support him?

- What would you like to see from this project?

A Tower of Power cover -What is hip!

- Which drummer should Dave record with?

Chris Coleman....crazy chops, see's him as a major influence on his drumming and has a great chemistry playing with him

As far as I'm concerned Dave's free to do what he wants, whether being totally artistic to being a complete sell-out. I won't tell him what to do.
The scary thing here is that it seems to be ok with some people that a company can alter and break some of its core rules to make money. Opposing to GREED is not 'negativity' or 'wanting to destroy the brotherhood of a certain group of people', it's wanting justice to be served.

My 2cents, peace.

I feel sorry for Steven Orkin. He seems to work really hard to find answers in how to deal with the modern music market. Sticking his neck out by openly communicating with the public. Being honest about what he is doing and how he is doing it. I also think he is on the right track. You will never know how things work out if you don't act. Asking for opinions is smart because you get a great insight in what people think and want. The process can be painful but in the end he will gain great value and we will all benefit in terms of understanding how we as musicians can deal with a world without big record companies. Dave Weckl will be copied again, not his chops this time but his business MO ;-]