Russ Miller leaves Yamaha- Yamaha moving to China?

[jem]

Looks like it's true
Sakae & Yamaha go separate ways.
http://www.sakaedrums.com/en/our_story.php
http://www.drummagazine.com/news/post/s ... th-yamaha/

Sakae: Corporatism and the desire to become the biggest drum company in the world are NOT our priorities

[Paul Marangoni]

Everyone knows that Sakae is coming out from Yamaha's shadow. They had a very big booth at NAMM this year. What is NOT clear is what Yamaha is planning to do with their various lines. I was under the impression that they were just moving all production to China, not that they were discontinuing all of their top lines.

[drumnhands]

I’ll step in here and enter the discussion.

We are at the beginning of an exciting time at Yamaha Drums, and there are a lot of fantastic things coming. Many of you have seen our Live Custom Series, which was launched at Winter NAMM and received rave reviews by dealers, artists, and press. It is the first drumset out of our Yamaha-owned factory in Xiaoshan, China. And this is just the start.

It’s important to remember that all of the techniques and processes that have made Yamaha one of the most respected names in drums were, in fact, created by Yamaha. The transition to our new state-of-the-art factory has allowed us to update and improve these processes and tools utilized by the craftsmen to build our drums. Also important to note is that the Xiaoshan factory was built from the ground up as a Yamaha factory and is ISO 14001 certified. Yamaha has been building pianos and wind/brass instruments in that facility for years; as a result, each craftsman is very familiar with our high standards and expectations, being trained not only in how but why we do things the way we do.

Ultimately, Yamaha drums will be better, while becoming more affordable: not by downgrading the quality of the materials, but by making the processes more efficient and still crafting some of the world’s best-sounding drums.

[Matus]

I agree Groober, and having not been here for a while, it's not pleasant posting something and having it be controversial. My tone in my first post in this thread was not pompous or condescending, however I found the posts telling me I was wrong a little condescending, especially considering that I'm sharing info that comes from the artists who endorse these products. I found that insulting. One of them was very condescending. Paul I believe said that. Combine that with a little common sense and knowledge of the oldest system in the world, which is bartering, now known as business and capitalism, and you have a common sense answer. My apologies if you feel I said something wrong, but if you scroll back , you'll see what led me to be a bit more stern. Drummers are not idiots. They are compensated for playing brand name instruments, the same way athletes are compensated for wearing athletic shoes. Call me crazy, but I don't see an argument there.

My teacher, who is not really MY teacher. He's a name player I took 1 lesson with, he's just not like the top sellers I.E Vinnie. Why would he lie? That's ridiculous. Also, you can't tell me you're not aware of the endorsement scam business model. Anyone who pays a fee for their equipment is not an endorser. That's a scam these companies developed to get drummers to buy their drums. If you buy at cost directly from Yamaha they make the same profit as when you buy it from guitar center. No real endorser pays for gear. If they do, they bought into the scam. This guy I took a lesson with easily has over 50grand worth of drum gear. 2 of the kits were PHX's. He didn't buy it, he wouldn't lie. Matthijs Ament, do have any idea what it costs to live in Switzerland and run a business there? It's one of the most exclusive countries in the world. I don't know what their profit margin is, but I do know that Paiste is a wealthy company. Wealthy in terms of making cymbals, not Bill Gates wealthy. Relatively wealthy. They're not just making ends meet.
My post is just using info I received from the source, combined with that lesson experience, and just an overall business logic. It's not offensive. It's just honest. Maybe next time I'll keep my mouth shut. I thought some insight would be helpful. The drum industry is a business, bottom line. I say we drop this, I didn't intend to get into debate about this. I just thought to myself that I would share info I had. I didn't mean to shatter anyone's BELIEF into how this system works. Believe all the greats just voluntarily act as promoters helping companies sell hundreds of thousands of dollars in drum and cymbals while only getting free gear in return. Believe that, if it makes you happy. Let me ask you a common sense question. When Vinnie was playing Yamaha, why was he using Gretsch constantly when the camera's were not rolling? Was it because he loved the sound of his Yamaha maple customs? All of those studio recordings we love, are Gretsch drums. I even saw him play Gretsch live a couple of times during his Yamaha days. Do you think maybe Yamaha offered him something that was appealing? I wonder. Why play Yamaha? He had no musical need to endorse Yamaha and could buy all of his drums if he needed to. He switched to Gretsch after Kaman purchased them because Kaman was able to provide him with what he needed ($). Drums are not what he needed. The man has plenty of drums. This is what I mean when I say business logic. Ludwig is owned by Steinway Inc. Steinway decided a few years back to put more money into the Ludwig by making better product and expanding it's endorser list. Have you noticed their endorser list growing quite a bit in the last few year? I have. Hmmm. Business. It's only logical when you have a decent budget to approach the person people believe to be the greatest living drummer. No? It's not rocket science.

Just my 0,2 on endorsements. If Paiste gives me say 3000€ in cymbals for free and from there I get to pay 70% less than selling price, replaces broken cymbals no questions asked, gives me national tour support, sends all kinds of merchandise, has a network of social media available for anything I want to promote, stays in touch with artists, allows you to visit the factory if you are near and includes me in their website just like any other artist, I don't really feel I'm buying into any scam. I'm just not a AAA artist. Call it what you may.

[Randy Walker]

Great article

http://davidaldridge.wordpress.com/2013 ... drummaker/

[langmick]

Yeah, just reading that one. WOW.

[Christopher]

That is a wow.

I'm wondering where will the Sakae hardware come from? If I recall correctly, Yamaha makes that in its mortorcycle facility.

Confusing as some of the pictures on the Sakae site show modern Yamaha hardware, but others show what looks like Tama like stuff.

http://www.sakaedrums.com/english/

[Randy Walker]

Not positive, but I think only the kick drum pedals were made at the bike factory.

[Old Pit Guy]

They're handling this like they've conducted the entire drum business of late : disengaged and disinterested when addressing the fundamental concerns of their customers, especially if they had any indication this was coming.

I'd wager that's how they got here.

I'd hate to see all those lines vanish or become pennywise/pound foolish imitations of their predecessors before fading away. Either way, used Japanese gear should turn over handsomely. I can see singles going gonzo on ebay once they're unavailable.

[Randy Walker]

I doubt the lines will disappear because according to Yamaha, it's all based on their design and technology. Sakae is just a puppet