Electric and Acoustic for's and against's

[fandaz]

Hi All,
Hoping someone out there can help me out. I spend a lot of time practising with my Roland TD-8, with headphones on. So I have a couple of problems related, if I take my Roland to a rehearsal, I found that they sound terrible through a monitor. It could be because the monitor is not good enough but the sound is crap. Put headphones on and it's sweet.
If I take my acoustic kit, again its harsh and raw.
So does anyone else here have similar issues playing Electric for practising/rehearsing and then changing over to Acoustic? I think playing the Roland with Headphones creates a false sense of playing skills and when I then play my acoustic kit, the sound and the feel is another level or two down.
As an example I was happily playing along/learning Cocaine and loving it but at the rehearsal on my acoustic kit, I could 'nt play the high hat feel (not sure of the technical term but its like a broken 16th note feel) on my hi hats, so I played 8th notes (yes I know, need to practise more).
Maybe its the rubber Roland hats that make it easier???
Anyone else experience this?

I've purchased a 5 channel Samson headphone amp to try out at rehearsal next as my guitarist has a Torpedo Reload Amp Attenuator. Anyone rehearsed this way?

Carl

[Cymbalfeltfetishist]

I have my Roland strickly for practicing at home. I would never attempt to use it live, even though I have the TD30. IMO, the music I play live doesnt warrant it and yes, it can be challenging to dial it in properly when playing with the band. It can be done, but I just dont feel like its the proper use for "replacing" acoustic drums. Like I said, thats just an opinion, the guys that are experts at sound and electronic kits could argue with me that they could get a great sound.

In regards to the feel of the cymbal pads and drum pads compared to acoustic drums, yes, they are different. They will never be equal to each other, so you have to adjust. But I feel you should be able to express what you want to express if your technique is in order. Your hands and feet should be happening.

The way I look at rehearsing with the E-kit is, as long as they are set up simular to my acoustic kit, and my shoulders, arms and legs are moving in a simular manner as sitting behind my acoustic set, then thats good enough for me. My muscle memory can be developed. I want the motion of those limbs to be the same with both kits so when Im at my acoustic set, it feels the same as practicing at home. Now again, there is a feel difference with the rebound etc etc...so adjustments are made. I dont know, even the ghost note stuff where you are using smaller muscles can be developed on the E-kit and used on the acoustic kit. You have to do the same things with your body on both. I suppose a patch on the E-kit with super tight snare and toms...you are going to hear every nuance...but to play those nuances, you have to do the same thing on both kits.

They are different animals, treat them as such. If the hi hat pattern wasnt happening on Cocaine with the acoustic kit, then make it happen. It can be done. That's why I like the drums...you have to dig to make the sounds you want to hear...they just dont happen - YOU make it happen. Its hard work, but I love it. I have the control how I want the groove to lay. It's not smart to get lazy. Stay alert on the band stand and make it happen.

[Paul Marangoni]

Electronic drums are completely different from acoustic drums. Unless you've got many years of playing experience, I wouldn't suggest using electronic drums as a practice tool if you're hoping to improve your acoustic (real) drum playing. Developing a good touch with acoustic drums takes time, and it's not going to happen via electronic drums. No way, no how.

As far as using electronic drums in a live setting, you just need a decent amp/monitor. Ideally, something designed for keyboards should work. It's definitely cool to able to switch sounds during or between tunes, but other than that, electronic drums don't do it for me.

[fandaz]

Thanks for your comments. I don't play my acoustic kit enough but when I do it's hard for me to adjust. Even the feel of the bass drum pedal is completely different. I'm not a great fan of Electric drums but for practising at home my neighbourhood/family definitely are.
So yes I need to learn to adjust between the two, knowing that certain feels and groves wont necessary be as easy on the acoustic kit.

[Lucas Ives]

Electric drums are much more forgiving than acoustic drums: if you hit the "snare" anywhere in the rimshot area, you'll get a rimshot sound on electric. Miles away from what it takes to get a consistent rimshot on acoustic. Same goes for hihat technique, ride cymbal technique, correct amount of energy to put into a crash, etc. The more I play the more I realize how much of groove comes from touch and consistency, which lead to *clarity*. If you want to learn to play the instrument, you need to play the instrument.

For working out some coordination and independence things they can be ok, but there's really no substitute for the real thing. If you have good touch on acoustic drums you'll sound fine on electric once you get the mix right. Doesn't work with the arrow in the other direction.

As for live w/ electric, you need at least a 12" -- probably a 15" -- woofer to get a decent bass drum sound.

[Matthijs Ament]

When you change volume on an acoustic kit, you also change the sound or freq spectrum. This does not happen well with Edrums. The best sound you can get is with mid-field studio monitors, I use Adam with two bass woofers and cross-over filters. It works like this, if you manage to get a reasonable sound at 85 dB you will get bad results above 95 dB with the same settings/EQ. So for rehearsal you need a different EQ to match the higher volume. In short, I hate the sound of Edrums above 92 dB. Thats why the Edrums sound 'ok' with headphones or within a bandmix, they are embedded. For me making music on Edrums is not working, I can't get any emotions in these things. Also the latency bugs me to no end when playing with other musicians. I use the TD-20 with the upgrade.

[Jim Richman]

I assume you are a beginner, maybe not. I would stay away from electronic drums when you are in the learning process. You need to develop your muscles. Electronic drums will only enhance your lack of technique and technical atrophy. When you have many years of playing, then the adjustment is not as bad. Try using a real bass drum with your ekit, it will keep your bass foot together.