LAMA

[littlegrooves]

yep, my instinct about this forum was spot on. Negative negative negative [...] The guy had a question, we had some opinions, leave it at that.

I believe that almost of half of the posts that you have made here (4 out of 11, so far) have been to point out how negative someone/everyone on this board is. Perhaps this isn't the right place for you if you can't get over that. I am about being positive too, but it shouldn't be at the expense of honest opinions. Like you said, "we had some opinions, leave it at that."

If someone on here has a great idea or displays something exceptional, I often hear support and praise. However, when the converse is true, the honesty still flows. Without that balance, would the positive reinforcement mean or be worth anything?

[Robert Bluman]

a. i dont believe it's respectful for anyone to preach to others. In music anything can happen, and I did feel that the poor chap who asked a simple question was getting a disrespectful lecture about how there are no free lunches and how he needs to pay dues. His question was not about that.

b. Educated well worded opinions on a school are one thing, talking trash about either school in question is just plain weird. Both places have the mission, both need to turn a profit. Both were started by Ralph Humphrey and Joe Porcaro two amazing contributors to our drumming craft.

c. Rather than me "getting over" something that's wrong in the first place, we can collectively be more balanced. When someone posts a high level playing video, acknowledge what you appreciate along with your opinion on what you think can be better, if anything. Professional name players don't play in a manner that has absolutely no redeeming qualities. Negativity doesn't balance anything out, unless it's a constructive critique in which case it's not negative. Bashing isn't right, especially when you're bashing professionals. 1% of this forum are actually out there only playing drums everyday. From what I see they rarely post if at all. Even if I don't fully love something, I'm not about to disrespect someone who has talent and has put in the hours of practice on the instrument I love. I have seen Dave Weckl lose the form on a blues and turn the beat around on a vamp, I have seen Joel Rosenblatt lose the time with Spyro Gyra, I have seen Vinnie Colaiuta completely screw up an intro fill live with Faith Hill. You'll never hear me talk any smack about those incidents because that does not change my opinions of them. Everyone is human and no one is perfect. I have my opinions on certain bands, if I don't like them, I won't listen to them, but I NEVER put anyone down or act like I can do it better.
Regardless of how you would like to use the word honestly in place of envy, I believe negative comments without a constructive solution are coming from a place of envy. Unfortunately, any one of us would chose to play drums only and make a great salary, which essentially is what the people we're talking about do all their lives. So really I think people should be honest with themselves about this so called honesty. This is how forums get such a bad reputation. I just think to myself, if it was me in any of the pro's shoes or any drummer's shoes that get's torn up in here, I wouldn't want some message board trolls tearing apart what I put out there. It reflects poorly on the whole community. Drummers are known for having a brotherhood, and being supportive. The thought process behind "get over it" in and of itself is a cop out. You can be honest without being rude. A negative comment is worthless without a solution. Really, saying you don't like something is just a waste of space, unless it's your project. Why bother? It doesn't contribute anything unless you have a better way, or can play something better yourself. These drummers will continue to work and play music 24/7 regardless of your negative opinion, so why have the negative energy? This is not a music review site, it's a House Of Drumming. I guarantee there isn't one pro member who would argue my point. Music is not to be judged, it's to be enjoyed. If you don't enjoy it, change the channel, don't waste your energy talking negatively because that will only attract negativity back to you. It serves no purpose. Where as positive energy is inspiring.

[John Blackburn]

Ignoring other off-shoots of this thread, i can say that when i was looking at both MI and LAMA, LAMA are still personally in touch to this day, even tho it never even worked out for me to study there. If i did decide to go study again, it would deffinantly be LAMA, because of the personal attention i recieved before they'd even got a dollar...

[YamahaPlayer]

Ignoring other off-shoots of this thread, i can say that when i was looking at both MI and LAMA, LAMA are still personally in touch to this day, even tho it never even worked out for me to study there. If i did decide to go study again, it would deffinantly be LAMA, because of the personal attention i recieved before they'd even got a dollar...

*shakes head* That is absurd reasoning. Here's why -

The number of interested parties to either school is completely different. Musicians Institute probably see's nearly 100x more interested persons and applicants, ranging from across the world. When I attended the PIT program was more then 50% foreign students (as an example to the international popularity of the school).

To be quite frank, the reason any staff would be "personally in touch to this day" (implies a lengthy time lapse) from any school (music or otherwise) is because they want your money. I'm pretty sure they aren't calling you up to ask how your cat is doing.

Again to reiterate, you're seeing the difference. Schools like M.I. just can't hold hands with everyone who calls and asks, or even shows up for open houses. Apply, get in, that's a whole different ball game. They'll hook you up with a place to live (as they have contracts with nearby apartments), etc...
The number of people who express interest VS get in is incredibly different, hence why the school is internationally popular, accredited (LAMA is not) and has literally the worlds best facilities and faculty.
You can take a music business class from Kenny Kerner (least mine was) then go to a technique class right after with literally one of the worlds best snare drum players ever, then walk down the hall to take a jazz class with a guy who was friends with buddy and played with charlie parker... how badass is that?


John I agree with some of your points, however there is an area between realism and fantasy. We tell kids sure they can be a space man if they want! Why? Because they are children and there's no point in dousing them with the reality that most their dreams are simply that, dreams. In reality trying to become an astronaut is worse then winning the lottery by far!

In the same regards, someone asking about a career in music who doesn't even own an instrument is pretty absurd wouldn't you say?

You have to audition to get into these schools, same with the Military's music program (which rpc also asked about). It's great to encourage everyone towards their goals and aspirations, but realistic encouragement is what's required for the real world. Encouraging pipe dreams without removing the pipe and opening the person up to the reality around them is harmful.

[Robert Bluman]

So much misinformation here. So much. I studied for short period at north Texas. Ed Soph is still in touch with me and I was there for only 2 semesters. I have heard Ralph and Joe are like that too as long as you keep the lines of communication open. Thats the sign of a caring instructor. My brother in law is in the NASA space program which has suffered a huge blow recently. If you have the drive, and the passion, you don't need the means, the means come to you. The problem is your projecting your broken dreams onto someone else. Let the guy go study and be happy, maybe he's so talented that he'll be given a kit there. If you really believe he'll suffer then let him learn things the hard way. A bad attitude doesn't help anyone. Absurd reasoning says YOU, and who are YOU? Who have you toured with? Get off it already, you guys are all your own worst enemies. You're acting as if you're trying to save someone, but it's so easy to see your real intentions. If anything, his drive is inspiring. Maybe if you had that, you wouldn't be on a message board.

[willyz]

YamahaPlayer, I'm sorry man, but your information is just incorrect- LAMA is indeed an accredited school, has mostly international students, and will also get you an apartment to stay in. While I admit that there was a variance in ability, each student improved dramatically by the end of their time at LAMA (I'm talking all skill levels). I know all this because I attended the school.

I mean no disrespect by any of this, but I'm not sure if you're trying to defend the school that you went to or if you're intent on defending your pride from going to the school you went to.

Regardless, and with all due respect- your immediate negativity and provoking statements have turned this thread into nonsense. I'm proud of my education and so are you, and as already mentioned people will always be proud of that stuff. But maybe next time someone comes along and starts a thread asking for some advice about their future in music, their education, etc, we can hold back our pride and actually offer some legit sound advice...

That's all I've got. Let's lock this one up and move on.

[John Blackburn]

I really didnt mean to enrage on here, im sorry if you find my reasoning absurd. Having studied at other music schools to degree level in the UK, and served on audition panels for places on undergraduate courses, and also experianced the application / audition process as a student for Masters courses, the 'smaller feel' and personal interest shown by those at LAMA was very welcome. If that is because they have fewer students, cool! It might mean more attention! Whatever the reasons for it are, i dont feel its quite as insignificant as you do, but it is ok for us to disagree about that.

In terms of the origional post, i dont feel that it hurts me in anyway to take 5mins to respond to the post, just on the off chance he is genuine, over the years this board has been a great source of encouragement and information for me, id like to be part of that in the future.
I hope that this begins to justify my responses.

[Steve Holmes]

" Why bother? It doesn't contribute anything unless you have a better way, or can play something better yourself."

It's Ok to say you don't like something, or think something is bad. No justification needed.

"These drummers will continue to work and play music 24/7 regardless of your negative opinion, so why have the negative energy? This is not a music review site, it's a House Of Drumming. I guarantee there isn't one pro member who would argue my point."

What? The only rules for this forum are here:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4

Whether this is a music review site, or X folks agree with you, people can post whatever they want here until I get sick of it, or it breaks one of the rules. That includes not liking something. You may have personal policies for what to say or not to say, they apply only to yourself.

[YamahaPlayer]

YamahaPlayer, I'm sorry man, but your information is just incorrect- LAMA is indeed an accredited school,

Accredited as a trade school , not a college. Big difference.

Thing is... I've never heard of a 1 year degree. Have you? Did you get a Degree when you graduated? A.A, B.A., M.A.? Were you're classes transferable as college credits to another university?

No offense willyz, you just a made thread not that long ago asking on this forum about tax issues as a musician. Schools like M.I. (as well as others) actually teach how students how to handle the business side of things.
Coming from someone who called it "The guitar center of schools" in your FIRST post of the thread, you'd maybe need to do some self examination before trying to dig into my words. Keeping in mind, you're still asking questions about being a player....

But again, what does it matter? The guy asking doesn't even own a kit. Most likely neither school would accept him.


Additionally, nobody has ever asked to see a piece of paper in my lifetime as a musician. Ever. Show up and play. It's all about who you know and where you are. There's plenty of multi-millionaire drummers out there who genuinely suck.

[Old Pit Guy]

um, ok there cowboy

I personally had a great experience at MI but that was 93. However, the guy that taught me the most is still there. Gary Garbitini. I know he lurks here too.

If you hung with Gary, you had a great time no matter what.